Why We must fight.

[LA_MERC_Mercy]

Why we must fight! (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,81450,00.html)

[LA_MERC_Dirge]

w00t Good article!

[LA_MERC_LaTech]

Indeed...looks like Fox News is probably a bit more conservative than any of the others...I like it!

[LA_MERC_Sabre]

fox news rox, it's the only news channel i watch...especially the orielly factor

good find ernie

[[Cajun] BigEasy]

My problem with this article is that it presupposes that the only solution to Iraq as well as other enemies of the US and terrorism is war.

[Cypher]

<sarcasm> BigEasy is exactly right. We need to give Saddam more time; I'm sure we can settle this without war. We can reason with him -- surely he will see that what he has done and what he is doing is wrong; he will come to his senses, and leave Iraq after setting up a nice democratic government. The world can afford to give him as long as it takes -- even if it takes another decade or two. </sarcasm>

Give me a break.

[LA_MERC_Dirge]

It seems there is a peaceful alternative on the table right now...

[[Cajun] BigEasy]

One that seems aimed more towards ensuring war than preventing it.


Did disarmament not start to progress again under the international spotlight? Isn't that the point? Wait sorry this war is about terrorists ...self-defense?... wait no its about liberation? Sorry I just get confused when our reasons change so often.

[LA_MERC_Cowboy_From_Hell]

Elaborate Dirge....

Scott

[bighead]

i think dirge is saying that if sadaam and his kids leave..no war will start. that the peaceful alt.

[LA_MERC_Cowboy_From_Hell]

oh yeah...duh. Ive got the taste of blood on my lips and forgot about that.:D In all honesty, it ain't gonna happen and is kinda ridiculous on its face when you think about it.

Scott

[LA_MERC_Spark]

Iraq has never fully complied in the spotlight of the world. they are still trying to dictate terms for disarming by stalling.. They still have produced no records of the destruction of anthrax stock piles for one.... the list goes on... I believe the only reason Germany, Russia, and france don't agree with military force is because of the huge debt owed to them by Iraq.....It's time for the UN to step up to the plate and do something...if they won't, then we will.

[LA_MERC_Diesel]

/me twist the little stick thing on the side of
Big Easy's blinder glasses

Ahhh thats better!

/me snaps my figers and ask how many am I holding

Big Easy there are a multitude of reasons why, that is why you are so
easily confused.

As was once said you are either with us or against us! w00t!

Mike

[Rooster]

Big E- Saddam ordering the destruction of a few missiles was just an appease by him b/c he wants to wait out the international community and see if the US will back off, so he can continue on his course of action.
The action that we are taking is the same one that we have been on, it has not changed. We are defendng ourselves from someone who will use WMD against us and our Allies. We are ALSO liberating Iraq from an oppressive leader. Both in the same, not different.
If someone steps to your face and thumbs his nose at you then you have to do something about it or that person will assume he can do as he pleases. We are telling Sadam that he can't do that and we will not tolerate it any longer.

[[Cajun] BigEasy]

Yes well we SHOULD NOT back off him until he does disarm. Keep the spotlight on and wait until the UN is in total agreement. The French, Germans, and Russia are not advocating that we leave Iraq alone to do what it pleases. They are urging that the inspection process continue until it obvious that it can not work. Iraq's willingness to destroy missisle is evidence that it can still work. Iraq is not in the position to strike us or our allies at this time. Continued itnernational pressure will ensure that it stays this way.

All of our reasons for war on Iraq are present in other nations and on more serious levels.

[LA_MERC_Captain_Obvious]

it is not war, it is a an effort to remove an evil person from a position that he has and will continue to use for create death and destruction. peaceful efforts have been made, a political take over was tried, right now forcefull threats are being made. If not succesful, then the "coalition of those who are willing" will forcefully remove this evil person from his position of power.

beneifts - no more madman in charge with WMD.
person supporting terrorist will be out of position of power
iraqi people will not have to fear persecution and death from their leader anymore
nations around Iraq can breathe easier and relax some.

bigeasy, do you believe saddam is not an evil person?
do you believe he has/can benefit his country?
do you believe the majority of iraq would not get rid of him if they weren't afraid?

and after 12 years of weapons inspections, they are still turning up weapons they should not have only when saddam wants the un to find them so he can show he is cooperating. if the inspectors didn't find those weapons on their own in the past 10-12 years, isn't it pretty obvious that the inspections are not working? and that sadam is not fully complying? he could have turned those weapons over in the begining, but he didn't. do you think he doesn't have alot more? do you think that he has any kind of morality that would prevent him from using the weapons himself, or giving them to terrorist that would be even harder for us to track?

[LA_MERC_Yankee]

I have one question for those folks that think we should keep doing the inspections - how long should we wait? A week, month, year, 2 years? Exactly when would it be all right in your opinion to use force b/c the peaceful "inspections" have finally failed? I personally think that 12 years of inspections (oh wait, we havent been inspecting for all of the 12 years b/c Iraq kicked them out and continually deceived them) is long enough. What would have to happen before we could use force?

[LA_MERC_Captain_Obvious]

perhaps a video of saddam doing a mexican hat dance around a chemical warhead that has a biohazard symbol and a note saying (deadly toxic chemicals inside)

or perhaps pictures of saddam with his container of VX gas next to a road sign that says "Welcome to Germany" and another pic with a sign that says "Welcome to Mother Russia"

maybe a 10 minute session with Maddam Cleo, the phone psychic would do the trick?

[[Cajun] BigEasy]

bigeasy, do you believe saddam is not an evil person?

No



do you believe he has/can benefit his country?

Unlike our goverment in the 1980's no



do you believe the majority of iraq would not get rid of him if they weren't afraid?

I don't have any idea as to what the people of Iraq think. I'm sure there are some that will welcome US presence just as I am sure that there are some who will resent it more than Sadam's presence. This will only be answered after we have successfully occupied Iraq.


and after 12 years of weapons inspections, they are still turning up weapons they should not have only when saddam wants the un to find them so he can show he is cooperating. if the inspectors didn't find those weapons on their own in the past 10-12 years, isn't it pretty obvious that the inspections are not working?
As long as they are finding and destroying the weapons I would say the inspections are working. Not the way they should be, but nonetheless working.


and that sadam is not fully complying?
He certainly hasn't fully complied hence the need to further and stronger inspections.


do you think he doesn't have alot more?
Part of the problem is that this answer is unknown and is also the reason for the inspections.


do you think that he has any kind of morality that would prevent him from using the weapons himself, or giving them to terrorist that would be even harder for us to track?
He didn't use them in the first Gulf war and there still isn't hard proof that Iraq has links with terrorism. Iraq is not the threat to international security Bush would like us to believe.

[LA_MERC_Dirge]

wth is your refrence to the 80's? I sense an unbelieveable lack of knowledge of the facts about 80's here. Perhaps you can enlighten us on this? OMG hard proof about terrorism. Did you not see the satellite photos opf the terrorist training camp on the Tigris river just by Baghdad? It was complete with the fuselage of a Boeing 727 airliner. Gee, what could they possibly have used this for? hmmmm

As far as inspections, yeah given enough time they might work, but no one here has 300 years and the only reason they have worked lately is, I dunno, the fact that our armed forces are cocked and loaded aiming at their front door. Now do you really want to keep 150,000+ of our young citizens living in tents in the desert and on boats in foreign seas indefinitely until all the weapons are found?

[LA_MERC_Dirge]

The terrorist camp can be seen in photos here:
http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/cold/photos_prove_connection_between_iraq_and_al_qaeda_ terrorists.guest.html

[LA_MERC_Dirge]

Another article linking Iraq to Al Queda

http://politics.guardian.co.uk/archive/article/0,,4296646,00.html

[LA_MERC_Captain_Obvious]

maybe delta was thinking of putting a hub in bagdad and they were doing some training???

[LA_MERC_Spark]

HA HA!!

[Lt.Dan]

[Cajun] BigEasy, I don't really think you have been doing your homework here. If we let Iraq grow into a Nuclear super power, or even a chemical super power, than we will really have to fight a bloody war. Yes, this war is about broken international laws but it is also about bring down a government that wants to play king of the hill in a game where there are already to many kings. If Iraq gains the use of a nuclear bomb than we will be at there mercy, our allies in Israel would probably be the first to die, which in turn would bring us to Nuke Iraq. Is that where you want us to be? If we give him more time and let these paid by the hour, no college degree required UN inspectors thumb around, than he will have all the time he needs to build weapons of mass destruction If you can not see farther down the road, than your existence is that of blissful ignorance. Talking does not always lead to peace, sometimes peace or stability must be forced, and it will be so help me god. I am so damn tired of these pacifies just wanting to turn a blind eye to the rest of the world and let every crazy person do there own thing. Well wake up, we do not live in a world where we have the luxury of doing so. We will not let these thugs threaten us anymore. I pray for you Bigeasy and believe me I never pray; that your children are not enslaved or worse, hurt in anyway by a terrorist or an evil empire fixed on keeping there backwards way of living, where people are shoot and killed for speaking there views.

I understand you are just stating your point of view, but if you would just look a little more into the situation, find some facts, ask even if you don’t go to school some teachers, college professors, soldiers, they may be able to point you to some interesting facts. You may not like me saying that I do not believe you are informed, but due to your past postings it is what I will believe for now. Prove me wrong, post a good argument and give a solution on how waiting, like we did 50 years ago with Germany is going to some how work its way out.

Here is a little something you probably did not know about saddam, when he stole office in 1979 he called all members of government to a televised meeting, which I have seen, where Saddam read from a list names of people who where to be taken from the meeting and killed, he read many names and many men with families were dragged screaming and crying to there deaths. The whole time he sat smoking a big cigar with no emotion on his face. He has gassed his own people; again I have seen video tape of this, little children frozen in time, bodies mummified where they fell. Yes there are examples like this in others countries, they will get there too, but for now it is Iraqis turn.

[LA_MERC_Dirge]

WOW DGJ DAN

[[Cajun] BigEasy]

Once again I am misunderstood. My posistion is not that we do nothing. It is not that we leave Sadam alone to do what he pleases. This underlying rhetoric infuriates me. My position is to continue to disarm him through weapon inspections and strict surviellence. You want to label me as uniformed, fine. It all doesn't matter at this point. We are at war -One I don't agree with - There is nothing to I can do to stop it. - So be it. I have a vote and a voice (thankfully) I will continue to use them.

[LA_MERC_eX1|eS' ch1|d]

I'm not a big into politics, but I have a few thoughts on the matter. First, no matter how good our media services are I'm positive that our intelligence agencies know more about the overall situation. No one likes a war because people die, some you know and some you don't, but there are things worth fighting for. Maybe you guys and gals remember the American Revolution, guess what without that war none of us would be United States citizens. We'd all be British, sorry part of the United Kingdom. Lastly and the most important part of my lunacy, if you disagree with what the President of the United States of America is doing, great. That's what makes our country the best place in the world to live, because everyone can speak their mind without fear of retaliation. But once a desicion has been reached, especially about a war, we need to stand together as a unified front. Why you ask? Because the President is just like your spouse, there are times when you disagree, but to the outside world you stand behind them all the way. If you really have a problem with the war quit bashing the President and call your local Senator and voice your opinion to them, whom you voted in. After all they have to agree to go to war too, which they did overwhemingly.