Perspective maybe?

[LA_MERC_Dirge]

Okay, I know the photos we have seen make a lot of people upset...

But just listen to what just came out of Al SADR's camp:

BASRA, Iraq — A senior aide of radical Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr (search) told worshippers during a Friday sermon in southern Iraq that anyone capturing a female British soldier can keep her as a slave.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,119325,00.html

Are you friggin' serious? And we are apologizing?!?! I know we should be better, but if this does not confirm that the people over there are in a war, then what does? My God! If anyone from Iraq wants an apology from me, then they better hop on a plane (probably American built) and fly their arse to NOLA and knock on my door and ask nicely. On a lighter note, I would like the terrorists, rapists, arseholes for giving us some perspective on their middle ages, woman suppresing, non-inventive societal values!

God have mercy on them and hopefully Iraq (the former bastion of creativity in the Middle East) can prove the world's steroetypes wrong!

One last thing: Memorial day is almost upon us, remmeber what it is for!

[LA_MERC_MadMAX]

OMG - Friggin H4x!

As Dirge said, Memorial Day is coming - everyone please utter a word of prayer for all the fallen US soldiers :)

[LA_MERC_Nutria]

This makes me so mad. We need to get our crap together. These guys people don't have any respect for any life and we need to strike fear in those people. I say they break the rules of the Geneva Convention, they should be treated as animals and put down. Any civilian doing as much as throwing a rock at one of our guys should be shot on the spot, because everyone knows if that person had a gun instead of a rock they would fire it. We should just drop the big one and turn that place into a sheet of glass. I really hope this ends soon. Too many of our soldiers are losing their lives over there.

[Silent_Killer]

That just makes me SOO mad, Keeping people for slaves, THATS DISGUSTING!

[LA_MERC_Yankee]

That guy looks like the Iraqi version of a Cartman from Southpark.

[LA_MERC_Spark]

lol @ Yankee! Man... there's not much you can say... i'm so tired of being pissed about this crap! I can't wait till the June deadline to see wtf happens... I haven't watched the news in like a week!

[LA_MERC_MadMAX]

Slacker...

[-FA- ManiacalClown]

I don't care what they're doing. We lowered ourselves to their level. We can't just write it off with a "well, look what THEY did to OUR soldiers." It is wrong no matter who does it, and it is an embarrassment to this country.

[Lt.Dan]

LONG RANT :


http://www.rr.com/flash/index.cfm?division=166 <- go here; this is my home page for RR. Go to the TOP STORES from CNN, click on the Accused Soldiers Profiles.




This video clears things up a little for me. Was a little angry at first, thinking they were just dumb grunts who did not know any better, but now I know. They really are just dumb grunts, not a one above specialist rank who did not know any better. when I say did not know any better, I don't mean the treatment of the Iraq’s, and I mean the fact that they took pictures. OMG, if you are going to torcher a prisoner of war for what ever reasons, don't take pictures.

I just know some one is going to post back saying, "what if that was your father or brother in that picture, how would you like it." Well, I wouldn't like it, in fact I would be mad as heck. I would be so mad that I would find the nearest soldier and attack him, heck I would maybe, just maybe try and take out his family as well.

Do you see where I am going with this. These pictures have put innocent men and woman in danger, even ones who had nothing to do with it. The rest of the World is consumed with this issue right now. Even as you read this I am sure some American some where is being abused Verbally or physically.

Any one who thinks that our poo doesn’t stink has never smelled there own. What I mean is We, and I mean THE UNITED STATES, which includes all of you, even recently acquired Canadians, are playing the public relations game concerning these pictures. We have been doing this kind of stuff to prisoner’s sense the days of the Civil War, demoralizing prisoners of war is nothing new and a common practice. We do it, they do it, and every one does it. Does not make it right, but it is what it is. The only people I am angry with now are the Nazis who let the pictures out. The Media and anyone making a big deal out of this has endangered my life and yours. For what, over something that the Iraq soldiers detained in the pictures in question made an art out of. Our troops were probably using Iraqi consultants on how to abuse them correctly.

I have found my self in resent weeks questioning my devotion to the ideals of this war. At first, I was still hurt over 9/11 and wanted some one, any one to pay. So when it came time to invade Iraq, I was all for it. I say was, because now that the veil of angry has lifted from my eyes, I can no longer support the actions of our Government. It is my opinion that we should have never invaded Iraq. Not one American life has been worth all of this. The World hates us, our troops are dieing, and for what. None of you carried on bit about the life’s of Iraqis until it became an excuse to invade. Now, people who were in support of freeing Iraqis are saying, “lets kill them all”. Well which is it, kill them or save them? For that matter I can no longer justify sending soldiers to do a job I would not do.

What are we afraid of, we destroyed there Army in 2 weeks, if we were so concerned about Iraq’s WMD, why did we not just say, “ ok, if you guys make one move, I’ll tell GW to push the button. But no, we let him tear @ss around the middle east with our Army. If we were afraid of Terrorists before, well now we really have to be afraid. We make new terrorist every day we are there.

PS, I Love my country, I respect our Military, and respect the views and ideas of all of you here. I am not voting for either of our Presidential candidates. Carry jumps from side to side to much for me, and I need a rest from Bush, I think the rest of the world would calm down just a bit too if he did not win this election.

[LA_MERC_Dirge]

Dear Sweet Jesus...

Well It's very early and I won't go on for very long, but I am very disappointed to see your take on things ltdan. There are several items in your diatribe which are not entirely accurate. Beginning with "the world hates us." Huh? You mean France, the Arab street? Amazing how France has come out in support of us on things lately. And notice how France is trying to distance itself from the "oil for food" program since its abuses are coming to light? How about the Middle East? Evidence (polls, interviews, etc.) convey that the majority of Iraqis are bewildered about the US's reaction to these photos. They do not understand how these acts compare with what was done under Sadaam, further, they have little sympathy for the prisoners in question. In fact, the prison where these prisoners were at were in the prison for either killing, shooting, or trying to blow up American soldiers. Point: they were bad people. Now while I don't condone the photos, think about whether you would be so upset if the prisoners in question were Nazis?

I said I wouldn't go long, so I won't, but one last point: It is darkest before the dawn. June 30 is the deadline to hand the country over to the new Iraqi government... Of course, everyone in country who has ill will against the US is trying to the death to foil our efforts (and yes, there has been a tremendous influx of terrorist types since they see this as their best and most tangible effort to harm the US). I'm going to long now, oh except for one thing "We lowered ourselves to their level?" By that you mean we have mass murdered prisoners, hid behind civilians and used homicide bombers?

heheh well, I'll stop now.

[Element|CS Goonit]

this reminds me of my speech class when we did a panek discussion. one group talked about the death penalty, and this girl said that each person that's executed can cost up to 1-3 million dollars. then i simply stated the last time i checked a box of bullets doesn't cost 1-3 million dollars....so line up n' pop 'em in the head cs style.

nuff bout that, i think it would be funny to set up claymores in their "hiding" spots and then just wait for them to blow up.....man, that would be cool

[LA_MERC_Dirge]

Ya know, I have been reviewing the latest and greates on this and this is the "big" picture to pop up yesterday, part of the "worst is yet to come" line of pictures.

I have attached it below. Now I look at this picture, and I can tell that the prisoner is terrified, humiliated, etc. But I think to myself, "gee, those first pictures were just weird, ya know piling naked guys and smiling behind them..., but this one..."

IMHO, this looks like justifiable military intelligence gathering. Maybe borderline with the clothing thing, but justifiable nontheless. There are reports that this guy was bitten by one of the dogs, but alas no picture and as we are a society that has trouble reacting without a visual record, I can't put strong faith in the supposition.

Anyway, I digress. Think about it like this, any information they could gather from this individual could be used to save American lives. In fact, I have friends in military intelligence that have gone through the interrogation scholls and they tell me it is not a pretty site at all. And that's just the first round of training!

On top of all this, I have strong feelings because I know that while what is being visually recorded and shown here is offensive and shocking to some, much, much worse occurs in many, many other countries around the world. My father was a POW in the Korean war, and he was tortured and interrogated for information with much worse methods. He would be the first one to tell you that it is not pretty, but it is a part of war, and those involved know it.

[Lt.Dan]

Oh come, on your not disappointed, but when you have some time please do address what bothers you about my post. I have read your reply, did not see anything in there that pertained to my post. ????? Except about the world hating us, but there is a lot more there than just that one line.



Dear Sweet Jesus...

Well It's very early and I won't go on for very long, but I am very disappointed to see your take on things ltdan. There are several items in your diatribe which are not entirely accurate. Beginning with "the world hates us." Huh? You mean France, the Arab street? .


I am NOT referring to the Government of France, or any other government for that matter, I am referring to the people, like you and me. When protests take place around the world in every major country simultaneously, you know people are mad. This war has been the most highly protested event in recorded history. Now normally I would look at these protestors and say, “you bunch of liberally hippies, get back to work, and your blocking traffic, get out of the way before I run you over in my Truck.” But just because I do not like them does not mean they are wrong.

I have 2 friends in the Army, both are in Baghdad. Every time we talk, they both tell me about how bad it is there. They both say that most Iraqis hate us. They are constantly insulted verbally for just doing there jobs. They are under constant attacks from militants and civilians. They tell a much more believable story than the media does. The media wants you to believe that everything is going just fine and that everyone loves us. I also have another friend in the Navy who is stationed in England. Every day in front of the navel headquarters there are huge demonstrations, like the ones you use to see on TV.

Do a search for web forums like this one, but over seas forums. You will find some very disturbing threads. From Britain to Germany to whatever you will find a lot of upset people out there, a lot. I have seen so many threads that I am sick of looking at them. We are all being judged by the rest of the world for what is happening in Iraq. Again I say “WE”, I mean you and I, not our Government.


Dear Sweet Jesus...
, further, they have little sympathy for the prisoners in question. In fact, the prison where these prisoners were at were in the prison for either killing, shooting, or trying to blow up American soldiers. Point: they were bad people. .

Did you read my post, or did you miss the part where I said that I could care less about how the prisoners were treated.





Dear Sweet Jesus...

"We lowered ourselves to their level?" By that you mean we have mass murdered prisoners, hid behind civilians and used homicide bombers?



Hey, direct that at the intended person, I did not post that, you lumped our posts together. Don’t be a lumper, don’t be that guy.

[Lt.Dan]

LONG RANT :



I just know some one is going to post back saying, "what if that was your father or brother in that picture, how would you like it." Well, I wouldn't like it, in fact I would be mad as heck. I would be so mad that I would find the nearest soldier and attack him, heck I would maybe, just maybe try and take out his family as well.

Do you see where I am going with this. These pictures have put innocent men and woman in danger, even ones who had nothing to do with it. The rest of the World is consumed with this issue right now. Even as you read this I am sure some American some where is being abused Verbally or physically.



That did not take very long. Here you go, this is what can happen. Thank you tree huging media and who ever posted those pictures.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4953015/

[LA_MERC_Dirge]

Okay ltdan, you're right, let's allow the vocal minority to speak for the silent majority and determine our actions. Let's ignore the ramifications of a democratic Iraq in arguably the most backwards region of the world. Oh, and another thing, let's let people who live in other parts of the world, who have no interest in you and I, as you like to say, influence what actions we take to protect ourselves as a country. Oh yeah, and let's also wring our hands and cry about how we are being judged by those people.

[[uGa] Saint]

I agree with Lt. Dan, the death of any American soldiers was not worth the War in Iraq. I am neither a democrat or a republican, Im fiscally conservative but socially liberal and I try to respect both party's. We went through so many different reasons why we were going to war with Iraq, yet when I look back I dont really see a good enough reason that we would invade the country by ourselves and risk so many of our soldiers lives when it was not necessary for our national security. And as a side note, its been reported by the Red Cross and other news agencies that something like 80 or 90% of the prisoners were falsely imprisoned or imprisoned by mistake. I have friends in Iraq who are only 20, and i would never want to do what they have to do over there, cause what they've told me is pretty bad.

[Lt.Dan]

Okay ltdan, you're right, let's allow the vocal minority to speak for the silent majority and determine our actions.

Have you seen any opinion polls lately? The minority looks like the majority to me.


Let's ignore the ramifications of a democratic Iraq in arguably the most backwards region of the world.

The last thing that country will ever be is a democracy.


Oh, and another thing, let's let people who live in other parts of the world, who have no interest in you and I, as you like to say, influence what actions we take to protect ourselves as a country.

You took the words right out of every Iraqis mouth. That is how they feel about us.

Again, protect ourselves. If we wanted we could have destroyed Iraq from here, but then we would have wasted all that oil. I think that 19 out of the 9/11 hijackers were from Saudi Arabia, don’t see us attacking them. Why are we not protecting our selves from China, They have recently threaten us with Nuclear Weapons, why are we not attacking them???



Oh yeah, and let's also wring our hands and cry about how we are being judged by those people.


Those people, you mean the rest of the world. We can not burn every bridge we have just because we feel we are right and everyone else is wrong. Making the rest of the world mad is not my idea of a fun life. We are really starting to push are luck with the rest of the world. It may seem like a joke, but what are we going to do when the rest of the world is so mad at us that it really is US against them. Are we going to destroy everything, over what, that little peace of earth.


You are taking this to personally, I can hear you yelling at me over here, and come on don't be so condescending by saying I'm right when you know you do not agree with me. Just because I do not agree with this war does not mean anything against your opinion or that I think your a bad person. We are obviously both entrench in our ideas, and we both think each others opinions are wrong. Maybe we both are wrong. Maybe we shold just invade Canada, just to throw every one off.

I am sick of dead American soldiers, I am sick of watching the news every day and seeing mobs of people chant, " death to Americans," Not one American life has been worth all of this. I support the War in Afghanistan, but I do not support any actions in Iraq.

[LA_MERC_T4rg3T]

Not one American life has been worth all of this

How many American's died in 9/11? How many random American's have Iraq's punished and killed before this war even started? Sure 9/11 was huge, but how many terriorist attacks have there been on the US in the past 10 years, how many Americans killed in those attacks?

Yes, we could have dropped the bomb on them. Are you saying that 100,000 "human" lives are equal to 30 American soilders?

Does the US have an army just to have one? Do we pay taxes to support the U.S.'s military? I guess everyone that joins the military is looking for a free ride, good thing its not another vietnam where you could be drafted.

3/4 of the people in the military look forward to live action when there is non. How many other people you know that spend years training but never use it?



Just random thoughts.

[LA_MERC_Captain_Obvious]

Not one American life has been worth all of this.

Do you have any idea what Saddam and his sons did on a daily basis to the people in and around iraq? do you know how the treated, raped, and killed them strictly for their own pleasure?

if they never find evidence of WMD, the entire operation was worth it just to remove sadam and his regiem from power positions.

I hate to hear about american soldiers dying too, but it happens. you wanna try comparing the statistics of this war with WWII? or even Korea?

[-FA- ManiacalClown]

Let's not lose site of the fact that around 300 prisoners are released every day because they didn't actually do anything wrong. That's a fairly significant percentage. Now consider that maybe someone in those photographs was one of those innocent that had yet to be released. It's certainly possible, although, granted, mere speculation until more information about the Iraqis in the photos is released, if ever. The mere possibility is damaging enough, though. Here we have the United States, the last standing superpower in the entire world and a nation the world looks to for leadership, possibly harming and humiliating innocent people. That's not too bad, though. I mean, accidents happen, right? It could've been anyone there, and surely not everyone has clean hands.

Might help if we weren't using one of the old prisons Saddam used for torturing political criminals.

Reminds me of the Committee of Public Safety's use of the Bastille. If ever there was a horrifically dumb PR move, that was it, because nothing says democracy than putting to use the major symbols of oppression!